this guy emailed me---kit issue

So this guy recently had a doe kindle, maybe four days ago. He won't pull and count them, he is afraid of the cold killing them, its been about 15* there. He emailed this to me today, and I wanted to know what your guy's opinions are...

I just checked on the bunnies .. there is at least one all white one. not sure what color the rest are.. I poked around and though I saw at least 4 or 5 but didn't pick them up yet. when they thought they were gonna get fed then where wiggeling all around like crazy so it was hard to tell how many.
I'll dig em out in another week or so. they are still kinda long and thin she has the nest box packed pretty full with hay and fur so, I"m not so sure they are getting fed enough... I took some of the hay out so she could get in there at least. lol I checked her tummy and she has tiny nipples... no milk bags or anything... is that normal? I'm used to COWS..... lmao

This is what I emailed him, in response...


She sounds normal, you REALLY need to watch those kits though, if they are skinny. She may not be caring for them. You can bring them inside during the day, but it sounds like she's not hurting them. I would put her in the box when you go out, adn hold her there if you need to, then check the babies after five minutes, and see if they all have round tummies. I will also ask on some of my forums and see what they think, but I think thats what they'll say. You really need to make sure they are all eating enough. I think taking some hay out was good. Does she have 18% feed and plenty of water? both of those things (if she DOESN"T have them) could keep her from making enough milk. Take out any extra treats, give her oats and feed, and water.<br /><br />__________ Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:29 pm __________<br /><br />I guess what I am wondering is, did I give good advice? Is there anything you guys have to contribute?

I thought your response was really good.

Since he hasn't taken them out, their looks may be a bit deceiving. He's seeing them active and searching for food... I know when mine do that, they look long and thin, like he described them, just because they're stretched out. Then when they aren't extending themselves, they look chubby again. Just a thought.

He might want to consider removing the nest box, covering it with a blanket, and scurrying inside with it, so he can get a good look at them and check for dead kits, since the presence of a dead kit could endanger the rest of them. I understand being hesitant to do that in 15* weather, but it's still a good idea.

Weell, I mess up the rules and bring them in before they kindle, and put them out ~6week during a warm spell, loose a few but not too bad.
I would say that if you are pushing the fur around enough to feel, you can push it to the point where you can see.

I like to do a complete pull-and-count at least once a day for the first couple of weeks, just to make sure all are accounted for (none dead or escaped) and have full tummies. If he's concerned about the cold, he could bring in the nest box to do the pull-and-count.

I'm really leaning towards the stance of as little interference as possible, so long as there are signs that mama is feeding the kits. After seeing the way our Alice handled her last litter, I'm inclined to think that the better the kits are buried for warmth, the better the doe. Alice, during a cold snap last week, had the outside of her tunnel completely buried, and it looked like it hadn't been touched in days. Opening the lid, there was over a foot of packed hay blocking the entrance from the inside. She's been digging and rebuilding this barrier every day, and the kits are all very plump, clean and obviously content.

The thing is, if you only saw the colony once, you would never think that she's been back in there since she kindled. The hay covering the entrance looks that natural, as if it had just been packed down by normal bunny traffic.

Every couple days I went in, lifted the lid, lifted just the top material on their nest for a moment, and checked visually. Of course, if there were problems, I would have taken them out and dealt with it, but (luckily) it's been all good. I think as long as you can uncover them enough to see that they're all alive, that should be enough. Once they have their eyes open, and are a bit more mobile in the nest, make sure all their eyes are clear too.

Of course, I'm no expert on this stuff like a lot of y'all here are, so if I've said anything incorrect, by all means let me know. This last litter, the first in the colony, has been very educational.

I agree with all you said about Alice's last litter, David, but it is easier to check kits in a nest box that can be removed and taken indoors for a thorough check.

We learned the hard way that Alice does not deal well with interference, but most does do not mind nest-box checks.

In the case in question, I doubt that kits 4-5 days old would still be alive if they were not being adequately fed.

MidnightCoder":ehilirqz said:

I'm really leaning towards the stance of as little interference as possible, so long as there are signs that mama is feeding the kits.

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I think I might agree with you in a colony setting, but I understood (maybe incorrectly) that the person who emailed had his rabbits in cages.

After seeing the way our Alice handled her last litter, I'm inclined to think that the better the kits are buried for warmth, the better the doe.

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I rather suspect that Alice is unusual in that regard. None of my does are fussy about my checking their kits, although one looks them over carefully after I've done so. In fact, a number of rabbit raisers would likely cull a doe that wouldn't let them check the kits (although I don't think I would go that far unless the doe turned into attack-bunny).

Yes, he has them in cages. I sent a link to this thread to him, I have been trying to get him to join, sometimes he asks questions I don't really know the answer to...on the other hand, I have learned alot and figured out many things that beginners don't know (I have always known rabbits, at least the basics, since I was a kid), so it is helping me in my website, so anyways, I sent him a link and told him he should sign up.

Thank you all for your responses!

Well, hopefully he'll join! He'll find a lot of friendly help here on RabbitTalk!