Could this be your breeding problem?

Wasn't too sure where to put this so, as everyone here breeds for meat, I stuck it here.

https://jeffreydachmd.com/wp-content/up ... c3Fx_qz1WQ

It is a very long read but well worth your time.

I have fed my family as much organic as my budget allows for years and made the commitment 4 years ago to go totally organic when I read the book Tomato Land.

But have only switched my animals over to organic in the last two years and even then, it has only been in the last year that they too are fed totally organic.

This below poverty level budget thing is a struggle. :roll: :lol:

The reason I have posted this link though is that I saw so many health issues in my animals when I was feeding conventional feed and I see so many people struggling with breeding problems that it just seemed right to spread the information wider.

This stuff is killing us.

But it does it slowly so most people can't seem to see what the actual problem is.

A simple experiment - that I did totally by accident when I lucked into a source of free bread at my local food bank - is to start feeding good quality bread, like from Publix bakery, to your animals. Mine all loved it, I gave it to pigs, chickens, and rabbits. All of them started getting issues after a few weeks being fed between 10% to 20% of their weekly feed on bread. Whole grain and white bread but mostly whole grain.

My rabbits started missing litters, they would breed but no kits so a big drop in production. My chickens started eating each other and their eggs, despite their normal ration being higher protein than recommended for laying hens, I fed 21% grower to the entire flock. And my pigs started coughing.

So many different things went wrong that if I had not linked it to the sudden free food I would have tried to fix it one symptom at a time and gone insane. Well, more insane than I already am, that is. But as I could spot the probable culprit, I stopped feeding the bread and yep, all the brand new problems went away.

As that bread was aimed at HUMAN consumption, it made me look at the world in a totally new way and now, if I can´t afford to feed it organic, I don't have it.

I do get that organic is just a lable and how much can you trust a label but we all have to start somewhere.

Look at human health and remember 10, 20, 40 years ago. Do you remember one in TWO people getting cancer? Do you remember EVER seeing autism? A simple google search on health of the past should be enough to get this stuff banned but the power behind it is staggering.

good article,
this problem is just getting worse...
and "breeding complications,[human and animal] are among the most often noticed effects of this toxin.
quote from earlier thread, ---
post327878.html#p327878

--The situation I am referring to cannot be remedied at all by cleaning, washing it off is impossible, - glyphosate is a systemic toxin. it is absorbed by plants and carried to every part of the plant, - thus corn, soy, alfalfa, wheat, [or anything else that has been in contact with this stuff], is literally loaded with it inside and out. Animals that eat this toxic substance in their feed, consume 3 to 10 lbs of these toxic feeds to make a pound of meat, - so - the meat , milk, cheese, etc: produced ,can have several times as much glyphosate in it as the feed the animal ate to produce it. The "human mother" eating these products, can produce milk for her baby, that is more toxic than the food she ate to produce it. So, the more products we eat that contain this,-and the further up the food chain we go, the more concentrated this toxin becomes in the host organism.[animal] - [sort of like DDT ,and the destruction of the eagle/ bird of prey population, experienced by this past generation ]...

I posted this on the Natural feed for chickens thread- but i think it may be appropriate to repost it here..

I wonder... if a new market for eggs, chicken, or Rabbit could be developed, based on "glyphosate free" and "pesticide free", eggs and meat-
People are beginning to see the "real info" on just how high the glyphosate levels are in our food, and in human mothers milk , and how glyphosate in our food affects our health, and the health of our young [failure to thrive, etc:] . Reports have now been made public [sort of] that show glyphosate levels are often over one hundred times more than even the "new modified"[greatly increased] Government established "safe limits"...
Raising chickens [and rabbits] on "home grown -non grain and alfalfa feeds, is certainly feasible...

yup - it is bad stuff...

That is a wonderful idea about marketing meat/eggs/dairy as glyphosate free, I wonder how much the testing would cost?

The thing that gets me is, how does the money they make selling it to destroy the planet and their own species make it ok to them to do it? Is money actually enough for them? Mum reckons it only makes sense if they are aliens and sometimes, I do wonder. :roll:

The paper on which this article was based has been withdrawn with lots of questions about the scientific method (or lack of) used in the study.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%A9ralini_affair

Likewise, Dan Charles, writing for NPR, noted that in the study, rats that ate 33% GM food developed fewer tumors than did those who ate 11% GM food, suggesting the absence of a dose response.[43] University of Calgary Professor Maurice Moloney publicly wondered why the paper contained so many pictures of treated rats with horrific tumors, but no pictures of control group rats.[44]

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alforddm":1z5doz8g said:

The paper on which this article was based has been withdrawn with lots of questions about the scientific method (or lack of) used in the study.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%A9ralini_affair

Likewise, Dan Charles, writing for NPR, noted that in the study, rats that ate 33% GM food developed fewer tumors than did those who ate 11% GM food, suggesting the absence of a dose response.[43] University of Calgary Professor Maurice Moloney publicly wondered why the paper contained so many pictures of treated rats with horrific tumors, but no pictures of control group rats.[44]

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I hate to sound conspiracy theory here but with the millions of TONS of this stuff used annually and the money backing it, it would surprise me if studies like this were NOT withdrawn.

The Weston A Price Foundation has fantastic information, not only on glyphosate but several other links to our plague of health problems that were almost totally nonexistent only ONE lifetime ago.

The rise in autoimmune issues and many other health problems started before the widespread use of roundup (1990's). I'm not saying they chemicals can't be part of the cause, but I think blaming it on roundup is not supported by the evidence. We are learning more and more about how important our gut bacteria is for our health. The decline in gut bacteria in modern society is due in a large part to to antibiotics. We have saved millions of lives with antibiotics, but that doesn't mean they haven't caused many problems in the long run.

When you combine our poor modern diet, with antibiotic use in early childhood and even during birth, and the stress of a modern life style, you end up with poor gut health. Most babies born in the US no long get B. infantis from there mothers because their mothers don't have it.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3744517/

Bifidobacterium infantis 35624 modulates host inflammatory processes beyond the gut

Certain therapeutic microbes, including Bifidobacteria infantis (B. infantis) 35624 exert beneficial immunoregulatory effects by mimicking commensal-immune interactions; however, the value of these effects in patients with non-gastrointestinal inflammatory conditions remains unclear. In this study, we assessed the impact of oral administration of B. infantis 35624, for 6‒8 weeks on inflammatory biomarker and plasma cytokine levels in patients with ulcerative colitis (UC) (n = 22), chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS) (n = 48) and psoriasis (n = 26) in three separate randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled interventions. Additionally, the effect of B. infantis 35624 on immunological biomarkers in healthy subjects (n = 22) was assessed. At baseline, both gastrointestinal (UC) and non-gastrointestinal (CFS and psoriasis) patients had significantly increased plasma levels of C-reactive protein (CRP) and the pro-inflammatory cytokines tumor necrosis factor α (TNF-α) and interleukin-6 (IL-6) compared with healthy volunteers. B. infantis 35624 feeding resulted in reduced plasma CRP levels in all three inflammatory disorders compared with placebo. Interestingly, plasma TNF-α was reduced in CFS and psoriasis while IL-6 was reduced in UC and CFS. Furthermore, in healthy subjects, LPS-stimulated TNF-α and IL-6 secretion by peripheral blood mononuclear cells (PBMCs) was significantly reduced in the B. infantis 35624-treated groups compared with placebo following eight weeks of feeding. These results demonstrate the ability of this microbe to reduce systemic pro-inflammatory biomarkers in both gastrointestinal and non-gastrointestinal conditions. In conclusion, these data show that the immunomodulatory effects of the microbiota in humans are not limited to the mucosal immune system but extend to the systemic immune system.

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__________ Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:01 pm __________

Another thing that I think is not looked at enough, is our use of plastic for EVERYTHING! Just because BPA has been removed from most plastics, does not mean something else isn't leaching into our water and soda. Who's to say that what replaced BPA isn't worse than the BPA?

I make pottery now. I'll be happy to help you replace all your plastics. I'm kidding...mostly...

Granted that there is no one cause to the problem but glyphosate works AS an antibiotic, as well as all kinds of other things.

It is pure evil.

But so are many other things going on right now. Everywhere I look we are being killed off. Too many of us on the planet but then again, suffering to death is no way to go.

Interesting fact, when I have to buy conventional feed - twice in the last year - I made the mistake of washing out the feed bucket in my fish pond, the way I do every day with my normal (organic) feed. Each time, fish have died within 4 hours.

Not a proper experiment but I am damned careful to not do it again. We did do a science experiment for school this year to see if yeast acts differently in organic versus conventional flour. We thought there might be a difference and there was. The organic rose faster and higher than the conventional. Again, it was not a lab experiment, just us in the kitchen BUT if we in the kitchen got a difference, a difference there was.

In my opinion, if you wouldn't drink a spoonful of it neat or bathe in it, don't put it on/in your food.

Great news on the fight against it, Florida Fish and Game have stated they are doing a statewide ban on the stuff. No more spraying it into ditches, road sides or waterways.

GBov":3uox5smz said:

In my opinion, if you wouldn't drink a spoonful of it neat or bathe in it, don't put it on/in your food.

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Arsenic is naturally in many foods. Cyanide is naturally in many foods. Everything is dose dependent. Just because it's synthetic doesn't automatically make it bad. Just because it's natural doesn't automatically make it good for you. I wouldn't eat a table spoon of arsenic but it is all natural.

The yeast experiment is interesting. Something to consider, flours vary quite a bit in their gluten content. The difference in rise could very well have been due to the variation of gluten or even age of the flours and not anything chemical.

The fish deaths could have been due to any number of things. Including mold toxins in a lower quality feed.

I do not feed my rabbits organic feed. The only times I have trouble breeding is getting back in the swing of things after I stop breeding for summer. I generally have large litters. I do occasionally feed forage but not terribly often.

I also think people greatly overestimate how healthy people were in the past. We are all going to die. I'll take the current situation over the past. https://demography.cpc.unc.edu/2014/06/ ... 00-v-2010/

And yet, in my family, we usually live well past our 80s and have done as long as records have been kept. Other than accidental death, that is. Drowning at sea has taken quite a few of us out. :lol:

I have yet to see a longevity chart made that took out all deaths under the age of 8. Infant mortality was very high - it is once again climbing, despite our so-called healthier world - but how do the numbers stack up with it taken out of the equation?

Given my choice, there are few other times than now that I would live in BUT dumping millions of TONS per year of untested chemical cocktails onto our growing food and into our growing bodies is simply insane and it cannot not be the root cause of so many of our emergent health problems.

And yes, the fish and crawdads could have died in a coincidence of timing and the yeast could have risen differently due to any number of reasons but the fact is, that happened. If I was that sort of person I would dump Gambezie minnows into tanks and see how they react to different kinds of feed being introduced into their water but happily for them, they can just stay in the pond. The yeast was about as high an organism as I want to experiment with.

We do all die, that is the finish line for everyone, but if we are what we eat, how can toxic residue not be making a difference to how we run the race?

I think the main thing to remember that no one person knows everything and to simply react with, "all this modern stuff is killing us", is not a reasonable way to fix our situation. One must defer to people who have more knowledge. Also just about anything harmful is harmless in small enough quantities. If you eat almonds you are ingesting the same cyanide that can kill you, it is just in very small concentrations. Also passing gas releases the same hydrogen sulfide that has killed people working in the petroleum industry, it is just that passing gas has 1000 times less of the stuff.

On the other hand there are times when corporate greed will force out new things that have not been adequately tested just to make a "fast buck". Also there are also times when new information comes out that something we have been doing for decades is harming us, but big money would rather hide the info to keep "raking in the dough".

The only way to figure out the truth is have experts that work for all the people and not just the moneyed interest. When it comes down to it there is just no way that the Earth can feed eight plus billion humans without the advances of chemicals and modern agriculture. Personally I think the human species could do quite well with only one billion well educated and electronically connected people. But that is a rant for another day.

JMHO ..
[opinion]
People are either mistaken or just confused, when they expect "The government" to be overly concerned with their health. The main focus and priority of Government has always been, and will always be.. "keeping the masses fed as cheaply as possible ". The objective is to keep people off the streets, control civil unrest, and avoid having a rebellion.
Hungry people are unruly ...
"The Health of its subjects" may be on the "government agenda" somewhere..., but prioritised far below "cheap food production"..
This is where roundup [glyphosate] comes in... it was produced , and it is being sold as a tool for cheap food production.

People who expect "the government" to watch out for their health, and ban the products that are bad for us...are either lazy, or misinformed about government priorities....
It is our responsibility to maintain our health.
There is plenty of information available on the health risks of Glyphosate... as well as other things like white flour, white sugar, and hydrogenated [plasticized] vegetable oils.
If we want to be healthy, and maintain healthy animals... it is our job to do our own research, and make our own choices.
Michael Porter

The only thing left to add M4G is that the people MAKING the stuff says it is safe while the people dealing with the worldwide fall out from its use say it is dangerous.

Who are you going to believe?

The direct parallel to what is going on today is the tobacco industry who, if you remember, said their products were safe.

Ghost, you reminded me of when Billy Connolly said ¨Now, I am not saying cannibalism is a good thing but, if everyone ate just ONE person, well...... Too many people? Sorted!!!¨ :lol:

I suppose this whole thread is off it's original topic. After the first few post it was destine to go something like it is going now. Maybe the thread would be better placed in "Around the Coffee Table" or hopefully not "Hopping Mad". I do understand there are many view points here and they should be given there turn.

[opinion]
I'm not here to defined or condemn Roundup, my point is that determining what the cost vs benefits is an issue that requires many people to dedicate their "9 to 5" to figure it out. They must also "show their work" in an unbiased way. How does Roundup effect consumers, workers and the environment. Remember workers are going to have a higher exposure than consumers. Having the stuff sprayed in your face due to a mishap is different than ingesting a microscopic amount in residue. What dose Roundup do in the environment? Is it being used according to label, or is it being misapplied? Does it "turn the frigging frogs gay"? :runaround: These are questions that a little internet research can't really answer.

When it comes down to it we can't make enough food to feed the world without nitrogen based fertilizer and some way to control the weeds. It has been estimates that over 45% of all the nitrogen atoms in the human body come from nitrogen in artificial fertilizer. Nitrogen is critical building block of everything that makes up all living organisms plant and animal. You can't have protean or DNA without nitrogen. Most organisms can not just get nitrogen out of the air. The exception is "nitrogen fixation" that a few microorganisms can do (many live in symbiosis with plants). Even nitrogen fixing microorganisms need NOx to get nitrogen. That is the same NOx that can harm the environment when there is too much of it. There just is not enough naturally accruing biological nitrogen to feed 8 billion people. I suppose that is why I harp on that number. :soap:

Then there is "the government". :grit: :roll: :hornetnest:

Government is made of people and people are lazy. Many just want their paycheck. Corporations have the money, so "just writing a check" is the lazy way for them to have power over "the government". For things to work out, people must hold there government accountable! Government must fear the people, when people fear the government you have ternary.

I should note that when I mean the government fearing the people I am talking about fear of job lose not fear of safety. There are times when the people say, "we need to throw these bums out", the government then wants to call those people terrorist. There only a few extreme cases where violence is justified. I think the operative phrase is, "those that suppress peaceful change, necessitate violent change". rotest:

Before I get off my soap box. I would like to call out people that would rather spend "all there time" learning which famous person is banging which other famous person, rather than learning "thing one" about what the government is and who it is suppose to work.

And yet, Ghost, organic farming and gardening, PROPER organic farming practices, actually increase yield while doing all sorts of other great things so, to feed the masses we need to increase organic farming and get rid of the chemical way of doing it that turns soil into lifeless dust.

Did you see where another jury has found that roundup caused a man cancer?

Opinion,
Having done my own research, and my own "field trials", .. there is no doubt in "my mind" that the glyphosate soaked alfalfa, corn, and soy in the "commercial pelleted rabbit feed" caused a lot of problems for the rabbits. When the "rabbit difficulties" began, I began to try to find the cause...The local mill in Utah, was kind enough to tell me that "the locally sourced" materials were grown by a farming company that plants "roundup ready" crops. [so they are then sprayed with "roundup" to kill the weeds growing in the field] Those soybean, and grain crops that were not "roundup ready", were still sprayed with roundup to "dry-down" the crop preharvest.
Since I can't discover how much glyphosate in actually in the feed I buy, I choose to grow my own feed.
Many farmers use "overly concentrated" glyphosate on their crops, and there is no oversight on this. As we develop more "glyphosate resistant" weeds, this problem will get even worse...
I eat the rabbits and chickens I produce... I am not going to feed that "stuff" to my animals, because I have no intention of feeding even more glyphosate to my family.

I believe, that in time the "real research findings" will be made "mainstream public"... - however, ..... look how long the "DDT" , and "Agent Orange" info was suppressed,[ and what was done to those "scientists and journalists who blabbed"], before it was eventually made "public"... I don't think "disclosure" will happen, until Monsanto/ Dow Chemical has something to take the place of Glyphosate ... in the short term.... they have way too much money invested to allow "disclosure".
... JMHO...

Money and power, power and money. And the lies have a life of their own.