Breed for Both Meat and Fur

First post here. This seems the appropriate forum. My apologies if it's in the wrong place.

Is there a best breed for both meat and fur? My understanding is that the Californians are appreciated for the white pelts that can be dyed any color, but I'm more interested in fur that is beautiful and luxurious in its own right without being dyed. We will use the fur for crafting. I want fur that will feel the best, not bring the best prices.

For meat, we want animals that can grow out to a reasonable size quickly, of course. And I am surprised to see in some of the online books that different breeds supposedly have different tasting meat. Does that fit your experiences?

I am looking at Silver Foxes for the purpose right now. There is a breeder of those in my area with a good reputation. The other breed that has been suggested is some type of Rex, but I haven't looked at one of those yet.

Thanks in advance!

Doozy Wombat

DoozyWombat":16mkm2gr said:

I'm more interested in fur that is beautiful and luxurious in its own right without being dyed. We will use the fur for crafting. I want fur that will feel the best, not bring the best prices.

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If you haven't yet, I'd highly recommend going to a local rabbit show (preferably a big one, so there will more more breeds represented, in theory). That way you can wander around and look at all the different varieties in person. I did this a year ago when the ARBA National Convention happened to be held an hour from where I live.

For really soft and plush fur, I don't think you could go wrong with Rex rabbits (not mini). They'll take a little longer to grow out maybe, but honestly from what I have read if you want to make anything with the pelt you should probably wait at least 16 or 20 weeks before processing regardless of breed anyway (or you risk fur slips and super delicate leather).

I've admired the Silver Fox rabbits at shows, too, and if you're looking for a unique coat maybe the Satins would be a cool breed? I don't know much about either except what I've seen at shows, but the Silver Fox seem to be a good meat breed as well. Hopefully more people will give you advice as well.

Oh, and welcome to RabbitTalk!

Nymphadora has given you good advice. Do go to a good rabbit show if you can. If not, at least look at lots of pictures online.

Both Standard Rex and Silver Fox are good dual-purpose breeds. If you want uniformity for a large project, I think Silver Fox have the edge. If you are looking for variety, Rex come in many colours and some are "broken" -- that is, white with a colour in patches or spots. This can make for interesting contrasts in your craft projects.

(Why not a trio of each??? :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: Sorry, we're all enablers here. )

I don't believe that the breed of the rabbit affects the flavour of the meat. Whoever wrote that may have been comparing domestic rabbits (descended from the European wild rabbit) to our native North American species. Diet does subtly influence the flavour of the meat, but not in a drastic way. When I switched my rabbits from a pellet diet to a natural diet, I liked the taste even better, but all domestic rabbit meat is delicious. It's not a big difference.

Take your time, ask your questions and enjoy the process. Rabbits are fun!

really, any rabbit can be used for fur! but you have to decide if you want white pelts or coloured pelts. white pelts can be dyed any colour, and coloured pelts are appreciated for their natural beauty.

i raise multiple breeds for meat and show, but honestly i've found the pelts make me more money, so i breed more than i can eat now. i've also found, that at least in the circles i'm in, natural coloured pelts are more desirable. my primary meat "breed" was developed specifically to produce a wide variety of coat colours in each litter, and people really seem to love them, even though their fur is shorter/thinner as they're bred to be very heat-hardy. one of my does throws satin coat sometimes, surprisingly. i also have mini lops and rex - the lops have thicker/longer fur than my meat rabbits, and the rex...well. i got rex more for fur than meat let's just say my clients really like the variety in coat textures and colours i can produce with these.

silver fox and champagne d'argent are great meat breeds, and an interesting coat colour, but i find that the lack of variety means once your customer buys a pelt from you, they may not need or want any more. so i would look for a breed that comes in lots of colours, including white, so you can produce for whatever your client base demands. or get into a few different breeds to produce a variety. i'm currently crossing champagne and harlequin into my meat crosses for a greater variety of coats per litter. people LOVE the unique ones!

Champagne d'argent, american chinchilla, palominos and satins are good for meat and fur. silver fox are too. Rex tend to have slower growth than some other meat breeds

Great answers all!

Nymphadora (great name!) and MaggieJ, good idea. I am going to my county fair this weekend, and there are three ARBA RCBA shows this Fall that I can fit in my schedule. I'm still a year or two out from getting breeding stock, but I wanted to get ideas directly from online experts before asking questions at a show where people might be very busy.

I'm also aware that I'll need to be cautious in what I say. I've run into a couple of people with very strong opinions about killing fluffy bunnies. Strangely, neither were vegetarians.

Shazza, excellent thoughts on variety in the pelts. You have some beautiful animals in your website gallery page. I haven't read all the way through this forum yet, but I assume there are several threads about where to sell pelts. I'll have to think more on uniformity for larger projects vs. variety for more interesting single pelts and variegated larger projects.

SableSteel, thanks for the comments on the different varieties. You have shown a LOT of different breeds! I'm looking forward to seeing more of what you have learned.

Thanks again to all!

Welcome to RT! You've gotten great advice on fur and colors, so I will just add this: you're starting to plan your rabbit journey, so stick around and keep reading. You will find loads of options on everything from housing to feed to great rabbit recipes. This is an amazing site for folks getting started.

Also, if you add your general location to your info, chances are you will find a member near you who might have what you're looking for when it comes time to get started.

I have never kept the pelts of any of my rabbits. But I have raised Flemish, Champagnes, Americans, Beverens, Palominos, and mutts.
I personally would say don't go with Flemish or Champagnes. The Flemish Giants shed so much I don't know if you would have any fur left on a pelt when you were done curing it. And I wouldn't go with Champagne D'Argents because of the silvering gene, every Champagne is different on how fast the silver, but the are usually not completely even in color until about 5 months old. The Beverens are one of the oldest fur breeds and there fur is amazing, they come in White, Very Light Blue, and Black. And it is so soft and silky. The Americans are also a fur breed, but there fur has declined quality quite a bit in the last 50 years. I've never herd of Palominos being a fur breed, but I think there color is beautiful! You might also want to look in to Chinchillas, they were once the most popular breed in the US because of their fur. Also sometimes when I butcher out my meat mutts I wish I knew how to cure the hides, because they are so soft and beautiful. Just my opinion and experience, like I said I've never kept the pelts.

DoozyWombat":3un1jck4 said:

Nymphadora (great name!)

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Thanks!

DoozyWombat":3un1jck4 said:

I'm still a year or two out from getting breeding stock, but I wanted to get ideas directly from online experts before asking questions at a show where people might be very busy.

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That's pretty much exactly how I started on this site. I joined a little over a year ago while I was still firmly in the research phase and am finally looking at getting my rabbits next month (fingers crossed)!

The shows really helped supplement everything I've learned from the fine folks here on RT, though. And I've made some great new friends that are able to give me advice based on our environment (needs for rabbits in California are considerably different from needs for rabbits in, say, New York).

I wish you all the best in your rabbitry planning!

Ozarkansas":1k6639vv said:

every Champagne is different on how fast the silver, but the are usually not completely even in color until about 5 months old. .

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They were bred for fur. The last part to silver is their head, which doesn't matter for the pelt, and most pelt rabbits aren't butchered until 4-6 months anyway (baby coats aren't good for pelts)

i find with my meat rabbits, that right about the time they're 5lbs, they're starting to moult :down: so far nobody's really cared - i always tell the client if they have any moult areas or other imperfections. the fur rabbits rarely get big enough to eat before going into their adult coats, so it all works out i will say though that most of my pelts are sold whole - head, feet, and all. though i'm more in taxidermy circles, not as much in crafting or clothing. i'm not sure how willing taxidermists would be to buy champagnes that haven't fully silvered, but if you're just doing backhides you'd be fine

Sorry to be a bit late to add my two cents worth but if you are totally new to rabbits, get all your equipment and then get the cheapest rabbits you can get your hands on. Go for every color you like the look of, either off Craigslist or a local livestock sale.

Breed them and work with them for a year or two and then step up into pure bloodstock.

Your stress levels will be waaaaay down and it will be more fun for you and once you feel really comfortable with rabbits, get what you really want then.

Even then the learning curve will throw you problems but at least it won't be a straight upward journey, learning on rabbits that cost lots each.

That way you can start NOW instead of in a few years time. Mwahahahaaaaaaa!

I'd like to add my 2 cents too!!

It's often been said that the breeder you buy from is going to matter more than the breed you choose, and it's something I completely agree with.

If there is a breeder in your area with good healthy rabbits and a strong reputation, I'd certainly lean in favor of the local goodness. It would give you the advantage of someone to trade stock with later, and possibly a good local mentor.

Zass":1sfzp17c said:

I'd like to add my 2 cents too!!

It's often been said that the breeder you buy from is going to matter more than the breed you choose, and it's something I completely agree with.

If there is a breeder in your area with good healthy rabbits and a strong reputation, I'd certainly lean in favor of the local goodness. It would give you the advantage of someone to trade stock with later, and possibly a good local mentor.

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:yeahthat:
YES!!!

I completely agree with this. I couldn't imagine being where I am now without the mentors who I have my whole herd to thank for. And it’s fantastic having someone local who can help evaluate your offspring when you get started. Or who knows your line’s quirks (I recently had a litter that had so-so fur at 6 weeks, but by week 8 it was waaay better)!

Nothing like Rex fur .... a couple extra weeks of grow time is well worth the wait for that plush velvety goodness.

Interesting enough, if you are not feeding lots of people (like my three teenagers :roll: ) rabbit meat, lion heads make fantastic fur. As I work through my backlog of dried hides I keep coming across the odd LH and they always make me go ooooooooooooh lovely!

And they are a chunky little beast with a nice dress out rate.

Just my 2 bits as well. I used to cross out Rex with Dutch for both meat and fur. The two breeds would make the densest fur I have come across and a 5 lb rabbit at 10 weeks had an average dress out of 4.5 lbs. I miss my little meat bricks. Once we are more settled where we have a bit of land, I am so going to get some more Rex does and a Dutch buck. I found that made the best cross for me.

Sagebrush":3ea7khov said:

Just my 2 bits as well. I used to cross out Rex with Dutch for both meat and fur. The two breeds would make the densest fur I have come across and a 5 lb rabbit at 10 weeks had an average dress out of 4.5 lbs. I miss my little meat bricks. Once we are more settled where we have a bit of land, I am so going to get some more Rex does and a Dutch buck. I found that made the best cross for me.

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You are right about the outcrossing Rex making thick fur, they go great with New Zealand as well, nice dress out and fantastic fur.

It was funny with my Rex, I had a problem with longer guard hair on the shoulders of some of mine and while I managed to cull that fault out, I have a NZ Rex hide from that period that has the normal length fur for NZ, with the ultra thick fur from the Rex cross AND with extra long guard hairs on the shoulder areas. It's a funny hide, that one. :lol:

Another fantastic cross for meat is Angora x Rex. First generation gives ultra thick fur and a huge loin, much wider than any other I have ever produced.

Following up on this a year later...

Thanks again on all the good answers and advice.

I still haven't gotten my stock. In the process of moving out of a tightly-controlled neighborhood to a place with space for rabbits and chickens. Still thinking Silver Fox, but one of the later comments about out-crossing made me wonder if maintaining two different breeds and using the crosses for production animals would make more sense.

I love the Rex fur, but I'm concerned about its length, as well as the longer grow-out time. I'm not looking to do this commercially, so the longer time frame is less of a concern than getting really good fur from a meat rabbit. What I would really love is fur with the denseness of a Rex, but the length of a Silver Fox.

Sagebrush crosses Rex does with Dutch bucks. GBov crosses Angora x Rex, NZ x Rex.

Has anyone crossed (or seen a cross of) Silver Fox and Rex?

I have found... there is as many differences in lines of rabbits of the same breed, as there is between breeds.. Rex rabbits do not "always grow slow", or have "troublesome feet issues". Neither do Rex rabbits "always have prime fur" quality .

When choosing rabbits for your breed stock, be sure of the genetics of those rabbits. Check the weaning litter size, and growth rate . Also,closely check the parents and siblings of the stock you are considering, ..just to make sure you are not buying one exceptional rabbit, from a line of mediocre stock.

With all that said.. if you have great breed stock, with great fur... the crosses will grow faster, and most will have good fur quality.. but not consistent color, or fur type...