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Super confused

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Super confused

Post Number:#1  Unread postby TeaTimeBunnies » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:48 pm


So I have a lop mix doe that is a REW. The first litter she had with me was fathered by the broken black lop buck that came with her. From that litter I got 4 broken black and a BEW. So that means Vienna genes. Then I was suggested to try her with a buck of a different color so I could see what else she might carry. This litter I bred her with one of my gold english spot bucks. I can't quite tell the color of one of the two in this tiny litter, but the other one looks like a gold english spot!! (I think in any other breed the gold is fawn...right?) What!?! I was expecting chestnuts!! I'm super confused now. Can anyone tell me what THIS litter means?
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#2  Unread postby LittleFluffyBunnies » Fri Nov 03, 2017 12:15 am


If the kit is gold you can know for sure your doe carries or is non-extension(e).
From the other litter, if there were only blacks, than your doe is probably self.
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#3  Unread postby akane » Fri Nov 03, 2017 3:00 am


Red/orange/fawn can all be nonextension of chestnut. Mainly one gene difference but the exact color name in that group for diluted or not diluted versions (a nonextension opal instead of chestnut) or chocolate based depends on the breed. Apparently there is also gold, which I hadn't seen covered in a breed before but I don't find lops appealing. A creme d'argent is the same just with silver but we call it cream... creme.... whatever. I would assume you just have one of those shades of the basic nonextension version of a chestnut since that's the simplest result. On a black instead of a chestnut it would make a tort so depending on the buck that combo is possible too from the colors so far. If there is dilute or chocolate you just get those versions (blue, chocolate, and if both present lilac) of self, agouti, nonextension agouti, and torts. At least with only a few exceptions we can simply call a self nonextension a tort(black), blue tort, chocolate tort, lilac tort like we usually do the 4 basic self colors across breeds instead of having 20 names for the various shades of different breeds in what is genetically the same 4 things.
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#4  Unread postby Dood » Fri Nov 03, 2017 8:08 am


Based on these two litters, your white rabbit carries self, non-extension and Vienna = _a __ cc __ _e _v

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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#5  Unread postby TeaTimeBunnies » Fri Nov 03, 2017 10:03 am


Thank you all. I figure I'll have the third litter be fathered by me Harlequin mini rex buck and see what I get from that. If she is non extension though, would that mean a possibility of tri colors assuming she carries broken? The other kit in this current litter is a solid color of some kind, while the one that looks like it's father has spots. As I said before though their fur hasn't fully come in yet as they are only 3 days old. It is in enough though that I can see the gold patterns in this litter and my other litter of actual gold English Spots. I'll post pictures of the kits though when their fur comes in. I have a sneaking suspicion that the second kit is another white kit. Can there be a BEW if only one parent carries the gene? From what I understand both parents have to have it, but it never hurts to ask.
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#6  Unread postby akane » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:37 pm


You can get harlequins with a nonextension/tort gene combo. Some being picky for show might say there is some loss of quality to the pattern/color compared to 2 harlequin genes but overall when you aren't breeding for extreme detail the dominant harlequin gene is just going to take over. You need 2 BEW genes to make a BEW but you can have both vienna marked and completely unmarked carriers so don't count out solids if working with rabbits that have potential bew backgrounds. Broken is often not mixed with bew lines because the vienna can hide in the broken and the broken on rare occasion can be so light to mimic vienna markings. Crossing lines of the 2 colors does not result in very desired purebreds since no one wants to sort that out.
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#7  Unread postby TeaTimeBunnies » Mon Nov 06, 2017 2:07 pm


Thanks akane. I checked on the kits again when the sun was out, and it turns out both of the kits have the gold patterns, it's just that the other Kit's pattern is supper light. She isn't a pure bred doe so I'm not worried about that, and neither my English Spot buck nor my Harlequin buck have any BEW background I was just looking for clarification to my knowledge of needing two parent with the gene. I'm also not looking for harlequins in particular from my next breeding. I am just experimenting with what I know I have to see what she has hidden in her genes

__________ Mon Nov 06, 2017 2:07 pm __________

As promised here are the babies. They aren't quite a week old yet. They turn 1 week on Wednesday
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#8  Unread postby Ozarkansas » Mon Nov 06, 2017 3:09 pm


Awww English Spot Lop popples! They are going to be adorable! :in_love: :love:
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Re: Super confused

Post Number:#9  Unread postby TeaTimeBunnies » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:07 pm


So I don't have good pictures of it right now, but the kits are a week old. It looks as if they will open their eyes tomorrow, and though the fur hasn't really changed their ears and the tips of their noses look darker than the rest of them. You can kinda see the ears in this picture, but I'm going to try and get better pictures when I get home

__________ Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:16 am __________

So as of this morning the two kits look maybe lilac torted and one has blue eyes and a little Vienna strip on it's nose. Pictures to come once my classes are done

__________ Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:56 pm __________

Here are the up to date pictures. Thinking over the genetics that I know are there, I think they are probably actually blue torts. I just realized how dark the nose marks look :lol: oh well
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