Nasty doe - what can cause sudden behavior?

I have a 7 month old doe, who has recently turned sour and I'm wondering why the sudden change in her.

She kindled two weeks ago (her first litter) - three kits, two whom died from inexperience on her behalf (lack of nest, fur pulling, etc.) and cold, and one I had to warm up to survive. I'm currently raising him alone, on a heat pad in a beanie. She has also been bred again.

I have her in an inside cage, so hopefully the second time round her kits won't be born and die from the colder weather we have at the moment. Anyway, her behaviour:
- Digging
- tearing/shredding newspaper
- chewing everything
- knocking things over and throwing things around, especially her water bowl, she finds amusement in pushing that down the ramp.
- digging in her pellets and scattering them all over the cage floor
- nipping me and digging-like/scratching behaviour when I put my hand into her cage
- lunging, and growling at me

Basically, I can only think two things in her sudden change in behaviour - either her hormones, as she's recently kindled and rebred again, or, she's holding a grudge against me for taking her kit from her?

I don't understand how a rabbit can be so nasty.. Especially since her sister, my other doe, is a total sweetie??

What can I do? She's at the point where I just want to get rid of her because she's so nasty. However, I can't do so until she has kindled and then weaned the kits (at least two months away) I can't sell her on, as nobody would want a pyscho pet rabbit. How can I calm her? Would putting her kit back in her cage help? *shrugs* I just can't put up with such an ill-mannered doe for the next couple of months if I'm having to wear gloves to put my hand in her cage to feed her and arming myself with a rolled up newspaper every time she bites or scratches.

Suggestions please?
Help is desperately needed!

Was she this crazy the first time she was pregnant? It could be a case of hormones. Has she been moved to a new cage? Is there a potential predator that has been harassing her, which can make her cage protective?

Can you give her a straw/hay filled box and let her dig like crazy in that?

Bribery. Raisins. "See the hand? It's got a raisin. You be nice to the hand, you get the raisin."

I like raisins, I won't bite.

- Digging
- tearing/shredding newspaper
- chewing everything
- knocking things over and throwing things around, especially her water bowl, she finds amusement in pushing that down the ramp.

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These are normal pregnancy behaviors, and for the most part normal rabbit behaviors.

My favorite doe, Pancake, was re-named "Pancake the Destroyer" during one of her her pregnancies. :lol: I've had a doe burrow through the bottom of a wooden nestbox, and my harli doe just turned a wooden resting board into kindling.
Give Mucky a phone book or newspaper, and she will make her own cage bedding.

In the case of lunging, growling and biting...it may be learned behavior (as in, she's learned that it works to get you to leave her territory), or it could be hormonalness. Problem with hormones is that they do seem to be genetic, so her daughters might be just as loony.
It's important never to try to physically discipline her, as that could escalate the situation, and potentially lead her into fear biting.

Was her sister ever bred?

It sounds like she was outside for the first litter, but now she's inside?

If I've got that right, she may simply be scared because she's inside. Unfamiliar surroundings and sounds and smells. You could try covering all but the front of her cage, to give her sort of a cave to feel safe in. You can keep a radio on, so she has sounds to get used to.

EnglishSpot":1muhml1f said:

Was she this crazy the first time she was pregnant? It could be a case of hormones. Has she been moved to a new cage? Is there a potential predator that has been harassing her, which can make her cage protective?

Can you give her a straw/hay filled box and let her dig like crazy in that?

Bribery. Raisins. "See the hand? It's got a raisin. You be nice to the hand, you get the raisin."

Click to expand...

She wasn't nasty, for the first litter. However I had her outside up until I saw her begin to nest, then I brought her into the inside cage due to the weather. You all may be right about different surroundings, she may not like it inside.

She already has a box of straw, but decided that it would be much more amusing to fling it all over the cage, and outside of the cage too -.-

I didn't know raisins were okay for them. I'll have to try that as a treat, thanks!

-- Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:12 pm --

DBA":1muhml1f said:

I like raisins, I won't bite.

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Can I trade you for my doe then DBA? :lol:

-- Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:16 pm --

Zass":1muhml1f said:

Give Mucky a phone book or newspaper, and she will make her own cage bedding.

In the case of lunging, growling and biting...it may be learned behavior (as in, she's learned that it works to get you to leave her territory), or it could be hormonalness. Problem with hormones is that they do seem to be genetic, so her daughters might be just as loony.
It's important never to try to physically discipline her, as that could escalate the situation, and potentially lead her into fear biting.

Was her sister ever bred?

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I feel like a newspaper or phone book would be ideal! :lol:

Yes, her sister was the first doe I bred, and continue breeding. She is an excellent mother, she's so tolerant and calm with the kits, and with me. I don't understand the complete difference in the two :x
How do you think I can deal with her to prevent her from biting? I obviously haven't been encouraging the situation, by feeding her when she does bite me, but waiting for her to calm down and going back half an hour later. <br /><br /> -- Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:19 pm -- <br /><br />

Miss M":1muhml1f said:

It sounds like she was outside for the first litter, but now she's inside?

If I've got that right, she may simply be scared because she's inside. Unfamiliar surroundings and sounds and smells. You could try covering all but the front of her cage, to give her sort of a cave to feel safe in. You can keep a radio on, so she has sounds to get used to.

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Yes, she was outside. She has been inside for two weeks now.
Do you think I would be better off putting her back outside, until say a week before she is due to kindle again? Would that ease off her stress a bit and maybe calm her down?
I have a blanket over the top half of the cage, but she is barely ever on the top story, she spends most of the time on the floor level.

Tbgb1912":2px7o90r said:

Do you think I would be better off putting her back outside, until say a week before she is due to kindle again? Would that ease off her stress a bit and maybe calm her down?
I have a blanket over the top half of the cage, but she is barely ever on the top story, she spends most of the time on the floor level.

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I wish I had an answer for this, but I really don't. It might make her calm down, it might not. You could try covering some of the floor level... or just wait... or just put her back outside. :shrug: There's no telling what exactly will work.

So I tried treating her every time I went into her cage, no luck. I have given up with her, as she has drawn blood through biting me, and 'digging'/scratching my hands when going into her cage to place food, clean litter box, etc. Tonight when letting her out to run around the lounge, she took to lunging and biting at our feet. She was hurried back into her cage quick smart. I don't think I have the courage, nor persistence to continue to deal with her and let her out to run around, unfortunately. She is just plain vicious. I am very skeptical about how her kits will turn out as she is due in two weeks.. I doubt I will get much of a chance to check them out with her being so physco :/

Don't feel like you have to wait. With her being so aggressive and vicious, I doubt anyone on here would so much as bat an eyelash if you dispatched her now. No matter what the reason for her sudden transformation, it's just not worth the risk of having a tendon severed. Two more weeks, plus at least four after that to wean the kits... is it possible she'll turn into a sweetheart after her kits are born? Yes. Is it worth the wait to find out? In my rabbitry, probably not.

We recently had to deal with a pregnant doe who had turned aggressive. I used her hay bin as a shield whenever I put my hands in there. I almost got bitten so many times. She has calmed down now, but we'll be butchering her very soon. I'm just not going to keep taking chances with this behavior. I think if I had another doe pregnant and acting like this, I would just butcher her out rather than wait for the litter and take chances with the possibility of an ER visit.

Your doe sounds like she's even more aggressive than mine was. I'm sorry you are having to deal with this.

I usually let the doe kindle, and then eat her and all the kits when they come of age.

Even if she calms down.
From my experience MOST hormonal does calm down around 10 days postpartum, but there is a very high chance they will get vicious again next time they are bred.
For me, just it's not worth it.

PAN LID.

You hold pan lid, ,you hold it between you and the doe...she can attack it as much as she wants and YOU continue doing what you need to do. She learns it doesn't matter and they tend to retreat.

Unless it is freezing there she should be able to kindle outside.

My rabbits kindle in the winter (Live in southwestern Ontario). I ONLY intervene when the weather is absolutely frigid then I will bring the doe in for three days. and if litter size is three or less I bring the kits inside for the night only. And just for a week.

ladysown":1221rk11 said:

PAN LID.

You hold pan lid, ,you hold it between you and the doe...she can attack it as much as she wants and YOU continue doing what you need to do. She learns it doesn't matter and they tend to retreat.

Unless it is freezing there she should be able to kindle outside.

My rabbits kindle in the winter (Live in southwestern Ontario). I ONLY intervene when the weather is absolutely frigid then I will bring the doe in for three days. and if litter size is three or less I bring the kits inside for the night only. And just for a week.

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Thank you for your advice Zass and Miss M.

I will have to try using a pan lid then :lol:
This litter will be the does second, with her first being unsuccessful as two kits died from the cold and her failure to make a decent nest and pull enough fur. We have been having -2 to -5 degree ;(Celsius) nights so I am very reluctant to leave her outside when she kindles. My other doe, the fantastic mother, is fine outside. She kindled last week and pulled tonnes of fur and her seven babies are still alive, but the aggressive doe I doubt will be that good of a mum this time around so inside she stays.

Just a thought..... Those with more experience are welcome to let me know if it's unreasonable. I wonder if maybe she is having a bit of pain from being all ready to give milk but being deprived of her kits, and her relief. If so, I would expect her to calm down naturally over the next few weeks as her milk dries up a bit.

Stephanie":t34nms7n said:

Just a thought..... Those with more experience are welcome to let me know if it's unreasonable. I wonder if maybe she is having a bit of pain from being all ready to give milk but being deprived of her kits, and her relief. If so, I would expect her to calm down naturally over the next few weeks as her milk dries up a bit.

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She was feeding the one surviving kit. Although he wasn't kept in the cage with her, he was on a heat pad in a box a- he was taken to her morning and night for the first two weeks to feed him, and still now nightly.