What about apple cider vinegar?

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GBov

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I was just fleshing out two rabbit hides - fingers really tired now - and got to wondering about the different pickles I have read about.

What about apple cider vinegar as a pickle?

Once when I was reading up on rabbit hide tanning I came across someone who said they fleshed supper easy once pickled in ....cant remember what.....and that the inner membrane just pealed right off.

Well, anything that makes that step easier on my hands is a good thing, right?

Would ACV be a suitable pickle? Or any other vinegar?

Right now I just work my thumb between the hide in my left hand and the pealed off membrane in my right but its so hard on my hands I can only do one or two at a time till they get better.
 
Try holding the hide on a flat, hard surface (like a wooden board) using your left hand and then with your right hand, scrape the hide using a semi-sharp or dull knife.
 
Mary Ann's Rabbitry":ia6utn4t said:
NO vinegar will work for this.
Click to expand...

Yay! I don't have to try and fail. :lol:

So bath time musings on hide working might be best ignored later in the day eh?
 
I would be very cautious about using a fleshing knife on the rabbit hides. I'm not saying it won't work but when I used one the hides got torn. I believe the is a certain technique for using them which I don't possess. I found there is a spot on the rump of the hide which I can pull up with my fingers and literally peel the rest off..gently.
 
Alum helps though :) 50grams in 3 litres of water. 12-24 hours and the membranes can be peeled off.
 
A pickle has to be a certain acid level. I always make sure mine around 2 using litmus PH strips.

Most people on here use alum right? I don't, but I don't think pickling is part of the alum process, or the alum itself is both the "tan" and the pickle.

I personally pickle my pelts with saftee acid before final fleshing and using a commercial (chrome-free) brush on tan.

Vinegar is mainly water and acetic acid, and IS used by a lot of people for pelt tanning pickle(a quick search online brings that up), although I've never personally tested it. I think I will, but I'll be buying the extra strong "for cleaning" vinegar and testing the PH on it first.

Remember though, an acid pickle is NOT a tan. A tan would have to be used after a vinegar pickle.
 
The alum is only the pickle part (remember it was to used in canning to keep veggies crisp). The hide is not actually tanned with alum. But, the pickled alum hide will last quite sometime without tanning. I do find that the hide pulls right off it the pickle is strong enough. I've never fleshed my hides with a knife.
 
I know alum isn't an actual tanning agent, and calling it an alum pickle or an alum tan pretty much causes a lot of confusion, but that's what we call it. :D :roll:

It isn't quite like any other "pickle" used in tanning, because it does indeed preserve the pelt on it's own, but it isn't considered an actual tan, because the alum can be rinsed out or can sweat out over time.
 
I've seen pelts that last for 20 years with alum pickling. That's longer than I ever need anything to last.
 
:yes:

Alum is used by many, and I wasn't saying anything negative about it. Only that tanning lingo is confusing when used for alum. :D

Vinegar(acetic acid) would have no place in an ALUM tanning process (because the alum is already all the pickle you would need), but might have a place in a different tanning process. I will try it out and post results if I find a vinegar with the right acidity.

the process would be like :
salt
pickle (3 days)
final fleshing
brush on tan(Rittels quick-n-eze tan, overnight)
dry and break

It won't mean anything for his/her post if GBov uses alum though. hmmm
 
Zass":10741cyt said:
:yes:

Alum is used by many, and I wasn't saying anything negative about it. Only that tanning lingo is confusing when used for alum. :D

Vinegar(acetic acid) would have no place in an ALUM tanning process (because the alum is already all the pickle you would need), but might have a place in a different tanning process. I will try it out and post results if I find a vinegar with the right acidity.

the process would be like :
salt
pickle (3 days)
final fleshing
brush on tan(Rittels quick-n-eze tan, overnight)
dry and break

It won't mean anything for his/her post if GBov uses alum though. hmmm
Click to expand...

Right now I flesh the hide and wash it really well, roll into a towel, walk all over it to get as much water out as I can, lay hide side up on kitchen table, rub it really well with brains, let dry till tacky and then stretch LOTS and LOTS with my hands till soft and floppy.

I was just wondering if vinegar would help the fleshing bit? Its really hard on my hands pulling it off the hide.<br /><br />__________ Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:58 am __________<br /><br />Can you use a pickle with brain tanning?
 
Pickling would be a messy extra step, totally unneeded for brain tanning.
It does make fleshing a bit easier, but not enough to warrant the cost, I'd think. It mostly just preserves the hide, and gets it ready for other types of tan. I did see a vinegar pickle being used to help prevent hair slippage on "questionable" pelts on one website. (where the tanner thought they weren't fresh enough to simply brain)

Have you ever used borax while fleshing? It can help you get a much better grip on all that slippery membrane.

The other thing I can say that might work better is maybe you could add to your collection of fleshing tools.

http://www.mckenziesp.com/T7241-P19950C1927.aspx This one could easily be made with an old bent sawblade (I have one my hubby made me actually, make sure the teeth aren't too pointy)

but my all time favorite tools for fleshing are old fashioned carpet knives, them being old and worn out enough to have a rounded tip is important for this application

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hawkbill-Knife- ... 27da858096
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Carpet- ... 417903b1cc
 
Oh, no, didn't think anything negative. Just saying that while it may wash out, Alum pickles can last a long time. They last even longer if an actual tan process is applied.

Since the hide is not sliding off, I am wondering if enough salt is being used?
 
skysthelimit":1i7r0e8a said:
Since the hide is not sliding off, I am wondering if enough salt is being used?
Click to expand...

Salting is generally avoided in brain tanning. I noticed Gbov didn't mention it at all, and that makes sense to me.

The syn-tans that I prefer to use work best with salted pelts (though it isn't necessary at all), and yeah, fleshing IS quite a bit easier after 12-24 hours of salting.
 
Ah ha.

Got it. Salt for the others, none for brain tan. I didn't read the whole procedure for bark tanning, I wonder if no salt for them as well?
 
bark tanning is done with hair-off pelts, the recipes I've used never call for salt.

I will probably be doing more bark tanned deer skins this year, as hunters always want to unload their pelts on me AFTER the hair has already begun to fall out. haha, plenty of leather to play with at least. So many types of bark to try! :D

Actually I'm curious about vinegar in an acid pickle for it's odor neutralizing abilities. Some of my bucks finish their tanning still smelling a bit "buckish" if you know what I mean.
 

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