any thoughts on Colours?

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ladysown

ladysown

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from a fellow breeder, not sure on colours

these from a mini rex Mom is a blue otter(choc otter mom and japenese harli dad) Dad is a Tri(Tri mom and Japenese harli dad)
minirexes002.jpg


minirexes001.jpg


these from HL - black chin momma, chocolate otter dad
Gemskitsmagpieharlilionheadsrexes002.jpg


Gemskitsmagpieharlilionheadsrexes001.jpg


the breeder is most interested in figuring out the the brownish ones are.
 
They have otter markings (would also be agouti markings but we are crossing otters here so the markings are from tan gene not agouti gene) so any that are solidly brown are probably chocolate otter. The chinchilla gene could come in to play later on though. Depends if it exists on both sides or not. Any with striping would be magpie or harlequin. The spots are of course brokens but hard to see if they are black or blue.
 
The mini rex are probably "otterized" choc. harlequins... The others from the mini lop have an Agouti mom, so they only way those are otters is if she carries either one self or one self/otter gene. They almost look like some sort of Chocolate chin, but the picture is not too clear and the lighting may be off. It might be easier to see them out of the nest away from each other. Any otters should have some sort of tan triangle between their shoulder blades. :)

if the chin gene is present then the otters would become silver martens and the tan triangle would be white/silver instead.
 
Black chin usually refers to self aa B- cchd- D- E- . Everytime I've seen agouti chin referred to it was without a 2nd color name so just chinchilla.
 
http://www.thenaturetrail.com/Rabbit-Co ... -Chart.htm black chinchilla right at the top and just "chinchilla" in the agouti section. Most places I see A- cchd- they call it chinchilla or standard chinchilla. Then use blue, chocolate, etc... in front of it if it's a nonblack agouti. I only see black added for a or at plus cchd that need the base color spelled out.
 
I was just at a friends house yesterday and she had chocolate agouti mini lops that age that looked just like some of your kits. Now some of them do appear to be harlquined, and there's a good chance that the non-harlies will have have harlequin markings on their bellies. I've seen that, bred my magpie to a silver martin, kits all looked full silver martin until you looked at their bellies. Have had it pop up in MR otter kits too, sometimes on the ear margins and bellies.
 
In this case we don't know what the parents are so ladysown spelled it out.The nature trail website is from 2005 and thats how that particular breeder wrote the page, its still fine to say black chin and refer to Agouti.Selfs do "carry" chin genes without it showing and that is what the chart refers to; the chin "modifier".As you can see they are placed in dominant to least dominant order across the top of the page The modifier suppresses all red/tan colouration and is attached to the C-series genes.. Pam Nock is a long time judge and geneticist and well known in the rabbit world . Anyways I guess ladysown could correct me on if the HL mom is indeed a self or agouti. I just don't see the otter markings on the back of the neck in that kit at the top of the pic. They do indeed seem to have agouti markings as their ears are not solid brown.

Honorine we had some Otters that were harlequinized just like that once, you could only tell on their bellies, it was pretty funny :)
 

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